HD Disc Format War Not Over By a Long Shot

[Vinyl Rules!]

Originally Posted by TheMoose

I'm sorry but in what kind of "geek infested" site does 67.7% of the poll respondents either not need HD or not even know what it is??
That sounds to me like a bunch of die hard hd-dvd fanboys tilting a poll.
That sounds more like the response you get from polling a nursing home not a geek site!!

The only way it's the end of the discussion is to those hardcore hd-dvd guys that are bitter they lost the war.

Moose, Moose, Moose,

You are just a mere troll, and not even a good one

First, you write, "I'm sorry but in what kind of "geek infested" site does 67.7% of the poll respondents either not need HD or not even know what it is??" This is simply a troll because these geeks do not reflect your own personal belief structure. You have attacked them for their beliefs (their response to the poll). You are obviously distraught they do not agree with you.

Next, you write, "That sounds to me like a bunch of die hard hd-dvd fanboys tilting a poll." This is just another troll attempt by you. Please tell me, Moose: How is the 10.3% "die hard hd-dvd fanboys number "tilting a poll" when it is lower than the 13.2% Blue Ray number? See, I was right on target with my two-digit IQ comment. Oh, and your first sentence in red, in your first comment above, is grammatically incorrect and not a complete sentence.

Finally, you wrote, "That sounds more like the response you get from polling a nursing home not a geek site!!" Now you're dissin' senior citizens and lumping them in with geeks. Care to explain to us why this is NOT a troll?

As for your comment about A/V geeks vs. Computer geeks, well, there are at least one thousand (1,000) real computer geeks for every one (1) wanna-be A/V geek. If you want to argue this point, just do some googling on home penetration of computers vs. home penetration of A/V receivers and/or A/V electronic separates.

A/V geeks are an insignificant economic market when compared to the computer market and this ratio is not going to change, ever. Downloads are the future and the silver disc is in its twilight and the content providers don't care as long as they get paid.

Now go crawl back under your bridge and please don't bother me any more.

[AudAdv]

Vinyl, you are just as much a troll in this case as anyone. You didn't even do Moose the courtesy of reading his post thoroughly enough to understand it before unleashing an exceedingly long rant/rebuttal.

By the way, I am a long-time ISF-certified tech (even before Joe Kane split) and I have been fully trained on the old optical comparator, the ancient Phillips piece, the CP-5000 and now the OTC-1000 and I know good quality video when I see it. I owned the famous Oppo DV-981HD and had it hooked up to my Sony KDSR-50XBR2 along with a Pioneer Elite DV-59AVi, a Sony PS3 and (temporarily) a Toshiba HD-XA2. All were connected via HDMI when they were in the system.

Even from my 15-foot viewing distance, the Oppo looked nowhere near as good as either of the legit HD sources and the Pioneer was undeniably better as well. Obviously it was even more dramatic as I moved closer. I know what the famous hometheaterhifi "benchmark" test says about the Oppo, but that's just a bunch of pass-fail tests based mainly on frame syncing, none of the tests count real resolution, false contouring or any subjective picture quality ratings, which are all at least as important as the benchmark tests.

Anyway, I see where this thread is headed, so I'm gonna bail now before there is any blood. Yes, I've fired a shot and I'm running away, that's life. Y'all have fun.

[rlpiii]

Originally Posted by kennyt

goldear,

You have heard about spending good money after bad right?

I have had both formats since day one (well, maybe day 10 but not much more on either front) and even I have not bought any HD DVD's since Warner dropped out.

You are getting HD for a song, and that is good, but you are also buying an obsolete product and one that certainly will be non-existent in a year tops. All those cheap titles will be useless when your player dies, and if you've been following the forums, you know all these new format players are suspect at best.

While I am glad you got a HD disc player for your system, I seriously think you need to reconsider your logic.

Realize those HD DVD's will soon be the Beta's of the world and you won't be able to give them away soon. Add to that the fact all future titles will only be coming out on Blu-ray and you WILL end up buying a BLu-ray player in the future, only adding to your total cost.

Think about it, when Beta died, what did those who bought up all those cheap Beta players and tapes do with them??? DOes door stop sound familiar?

I really do not mean to sound rude, and I apologize if my reply has sounded that way, but you must be made to see the futility of your system and that frankly it just doesn't add up.

Five free HD DVD's and even as many as you might buy at 50% off will never keep you interested when you WANT to see any new releases in the future.

You seem to forget with an HD DVD player you can still play regular DVDs. You were just screwed with a Beta player. Most people that do not want to spend $200+ on a player of any kind can now at least have the option of up-converting their DVDs to "HD" with an HD DVD player to get more out of their new "HD" capable TV. Also, they can purchase the soon to be bargain basement priced HD DVDs and (maybe) see why HD media is so popular.

[gstarr]

No doubt, Blu Ray will never be as big as DVD's. But it will be quite big. Sure, it might not be big with the under 30 crowd, except when they get Blu Ray drives in their computers. But the largest demographic in the US are baby boomers and they mostly own (or will shortly) HDTV's and will buy large quantities of Blu Ray players. Parents will buy them. They will even be offered eventually in SUV's and the like for back seat watching.

Equating audio with video purchases is incorrect. Evolutionarily, the ears were never as acute as the eyes. Anyone that can't see the difference between good upconverted dvd's and Hi-Def 1080p content on a good HDTV has either bad eyes, doesn't care, or is still so angry over HD that they will give no quarter.

Maybe when most of America has fiber optics going directly to their house or apartment to deliver Hi-Def video in relatively quick time Blu Ray will lose sales and gradually disappear. But that day, except for the few millions that live in major cities, is years away. And quite a few years.

Geeks and the under 30 set never made VHS popular or dvds. They were far too expensive when they first came out. It was anumber of years before VHS was under $300. Same is true with dvd players.

Greg

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by AudAdv

Vinyl, you are just as much a troll in this case as anyone. You didn't even do Moose the courtesy of reading his post thoroughly enough to understand it before unleashing an exceedingly long rant/rebuttal.

While I agree that Vinyl's response was totally uncalled for to the majority of users here, it is what Moose asked for. You just don't attack data, old people, etc. and not expect a response.

Rather than seriousl discussing the data provided by Vinyl he attacked it.

Polls by NPD state that most HDTV owners have no plans of ever investing in BD or HD-DVD.

Vinyl quotes a poll of "computer geeks," who also share the same attitude but at a smaller percentage. Still the majority had no plans.

DVD appears "good enough," for a lot of people. This is a far more serious problem than overcoming a "format war," for BD's future.

[gstarr]

"DVD appears "good enough," for a lot of people. This is a far more serious problem than overcoming a "format war," for BD's future"

I agree with you--for quite a few people "good enough" IS "good enough". This is particularly true with tv shows and less so with movies.

With Netflix, Walmart, and Blockbuster offering Blu Ray on rentals I expect the demand to gradually increase for the next year or two, until it reaches a critical mass and becomes apparent to many people renting their movies that there is a big difference between the audio and video on these dics compared to standard dvd's. With the rental price being about $1 more, who wouldn't want the much better disc if they have a 1080p HDTV--and even more so if they have a surround sound system.

I think that the online movie and game rental services will drive the success of Blu Ray far more than just PlayStation. When people see the very significant improvement on their 1080p HDTV's, paying a buck more for a movie will seem like a pittance.

I may be wrong, but I think it will be the over 30 crowd that drives this format. Then again, I'm not a "gamer", so I can't say how large the effect this will have on buying or renting the discs. But I would think that a "gamer" who owns a PS3 certainly wouldn't mind renting a disc at a buck more.

Greg