HD Disc Format War Not Over By a Long Shot

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by Robinson_A

This rental thing is a test to see if it takes off which it will. I think it's a smart move however, in true Apple fashion (and because Jobs hates limitations) there is a way around the time limit. Setting your computer's internal clock back will allow you to keep the video basically forever. Honestly, it is only a matter of time before the rental idea changes to outright purchase.

1. The player checks the internet to see the date. Setting your internal clock back will not work. Plus that's piracy Andrew!

2. While Apple has the Studios support for rentals (as does Netflix) they don't have support for sales. The main reason Apple is starting this way is because they lack the support of 4 major Studios for sales.

I think the future is really in the hands of MS. Their X-BOX Live service is being intigrated into Samsung "Set Top Boxes," that will allow someone to pay $99 and be able to download the 720p movies that Live offers. Plus Samsung, Toshiba, and Vizio has TVs in R&D that have the service built into the TV (complete with removable HDs and USB connection for extra storage).

Getting the movies into the living room is the battle.

[kennyt]

I find it very ionteresting that HD downloads are already surfacing.

I have always said this would derail both Blu-ray and HD DVD if it ever takes off, and it seems it is at least taxiing!

Might be time to buy my Apple TV!

[prerich]

Originally Posted by Vinyl Rules!

Another factor driving Apple's strategy is the simple fact less than 5% of Americans have an HDTV with a screen size larger than 42". And it's almost impossible to see any difference on a 42" screen between 720p and 1080p. So if you are Steven Jobs, or any other CEO who is going to maximize shareholder profits, you are going to go where the money is.

And the money is with the video downloaders who will be perfectly happy with 720p. I can respect the fact you want 1080p with lossless audio, but the brutal fact of the marketplace is that you represent an insignificant group of consumers that no mass marketer gives a rat's tutu about.

I am not against 1080p and fully lossless audio - I, too, would prefer it to downloads, but 5 years from now, IMHO, this will be an even smaller market than those of us who still purchase newly pressed vinyl records. Were I the CEO of a video hardware or media content company, I would be wasting my time chasing 1080p physical media products - A smart CEO, like Mr. Jobs, will be looking how to get more of the 25 and under consumers to buy more iMovies and iTunes, because that is where the money is going to be made.

Yes, a few specialty manufacturers will likely continue to carry the torch for 1080p hardware, and maybe even a couple the content companies will offer 1080p physical media for a few more years, but the marketplace reality is that it is much, much less expensive to ship electrons to your home than to manufacture and ship a high-resolution DVD to your home.

Verizon has also figured this out with their FIOS service that runs fibre directly to the home. They are once again the US's largest telephone company and their foresight in investing in fibre to the home is going to allow them to sell many, many movie downloads whilst the other telcos and cable companies scramble to upgrade their infrastructure. Even Consumer Reports ranks FIOS as the best of all of the integrated voice/broadband/video services, and it is the fibre to the home that makes Verizon the 800 lb. gorilla right now.

Like I said in my first post, Blue-Ray may have won the battle, but both high-resolution physical formats have lost the war - They just don't know it yet.

My 23 year old son has Paradigm Atoms (that he got from me) Polk Audio SDA-1's (that he aslo got from me) a Fosgate model 3A (that he has also got from me) Klipsch 2.2's, DBX 3BX Power Amp - all from me - and he listens to this through....his Ipod. He watches movies through... his Ipod (didn't give him a flat screen - he's gotta do that himself) - attaches his Ipod to his DVD screen in his car - (I told him to stop that - that's dangerous). That's who Mr. Jobs is after, and they all do it. We are trying to communicate vinyl to an Ipod generation. This generation is all about convienence (this is why they don't marry, they leave home later, ect...) and this is why Mr Jobs is about to make a killing!

[Robinson_A]

Originally Posted by Lotus

1. The player checks the internet to see the date. Setting your internal clock back will not work. Plus that's piracy Andrew!

2. While Apple has the Studios support for rentals (as does Netflix) they don't have support for sales. The main reason Apple is starting this way is because they lack the support of 4 major Studios for sales.

I think the future is really in the hands of MS. Their X-BOX Live service is being intigrated into Samsung "Set Top Boxes," that will allow someone to pay $99 and be able to download the 720p movies that Live offers. Plus Samsung, Toshiba, and Vizio has TVs in R&D that have the service built into the TV (complete with removable HDs and USB connection for extra storage).

Getting the movies into the living room is the battle.

Lotus,

1. In regards to the clock thing, that was something I was told by some of the IT guys I work with on a regular basis that they heard. If it is untrue then I apologize. I myself have not done it, but it wouldn't surprise me if there was a very simple way around it for Jobs has always allowed for ways to circumvent the 'suits' that stepped in the way of his grand scheme.

2. Studio support for sales WILL happen. Truthfully, if the rentals take off Jobs will get the support he needs. Unlike HD DVD and Blu-ray the studio's need Apple and programs like iTunes for that is how the majority of the marketplace is going to get their content.

3. I completely agree, but where I think Apple has the upper-hand is that everyone, even PC users in the target markets, knows and uses iTunes. The Xbox thing is AWESOME and a huge plus in this shift away from discs, but iTunes continues to have aces up its sleeve and that is what the majority of the under 25 crowd uses. Now if it's built into cheap TV's like Vizio that's a whole other element that makes things VERY interesting.

Truth be told Lotus, I haven't been this excited about video in a long time. Ever since my first experience with a music server I've been searching for ways to be rid of discs, be it music or movies, for they're just unnecessary.

This is fun!!

[prerich]

Originally Posted by Robinson_A

Lotus,

1. In regards to the clock thing, that was something I was told by some of the IT guys I work with on a regular basis that they heard. If it is untrue then I apologize. I myself have not done it, but it wouldn't surprise me if there was a very simple way around it for Jobs has always allowed for ways to circumvent the 'suits' that stepped in the way of his grand scheme.

2. Studio support for sales WILL happen. Truthfully, if the rentals take off Jobs will get the support he needs. Unlike HD DVD and Blu-ray the studio's need Apple and programs like iTunes for that is how the majority of the marketplace is going to get their content.

3. I completely agree, but where I think Apple has the upper-hand is that everyone, even PC users in the target markets, knows and uses iTunes. The Xbox thing is AWESOME and a huge plus in this shift away from discs, but iTunes continues to have aces up its sleeve and that is what the majority of the under 25 crowd uses. Now if it's built into cheap TV's like Vizio that's a whole other element that makes things VERY interesting.

Truth be told Lotus, I haven't been this excited about video in a long time. Ever since my first experience with a music server I've been searching for ways to be rid of discs, be it music or movies, for they're just unnecessary.

This is fun!!

Your IT guys didn't tell you everything (neither will I - I'm A+ Certified) but there is a way - Lotus is right - that would be piracy and I will have nothing to do with that.

You are right again, I'm a PC guy but we all use iTunes - good way to sneek into Windows, Apple.

The Divx issue came to this - you continually paid for a physical medium that you thought you owned - I've said this before on another forum and maybe on this one - we own no content - just the right to watch that content. This is the way Divx could have made it - but not as a physical medium. People disassociate from physical mediums and then they don't mind the charges or limitations as much. But when you pay for a silver disc instead of just a download - you have a physical medium that's no more than a Christmas ornament the way Divx had it. Who cares about downloaded content - you disasssociate so you accept it easier. I'm excited too Andrew - very excited.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by Robinson_A

1. In regards to the clock thing, that was something I was told by some of the IT guys I work with on a regular basis that they heard. If it is untrue then I apologize. I myself have not done it, but it wouldn't surprise me if there was a very simple way around it for Jobs has always allowed for ways to circumvent the 'suits' that stepped in the way of his grand scheme.

It's still piracy. Something I can't condone. I know too many little people in the industry that could use the money lost from piracy.

2. Studio support for sales WILL happen. Truthfully, if the rentals take off Jobs will get the support he needs. Unlike HD DVD and Blu-ray the studio's need Apple and programs like iTunes for that is how the majority of the marketplace is going to get their content.

Right but Sony will hold out because they have their own DLC service in the works. It's to be tied to their PS3 Live wannabe service and likely implimented into their TV sets soon as well. Other Studios will hold out for awhile too.

Lets be honest there is no reason for the Studios to not support both HD formats but they don't due to politics.

3. I completely agree, but where I think Apple has the upper-hand is that everyone, even PC users in the target markets, knows and uses iTunes. The Xbox thing is AWESOME and a huge plus in this shift away from discs, but iTunes continues to have aces up its sleeve and that is what the majority of the under 25 crowd uses. Now if it's built into cheap TV's like Vizio that's a whole other element that makes things VERY interesting.

I believe the main reason that XBOX LIVE did better than HD DVD and BD combined in movie sales last year is the under 25 crowd. You buy a movie and can erase it, but redownload it for free whenever you choose.

Having the movies downloaded to something hooked up to their HDTVs is a plus.

Truth be told Lotus, I haven't been this excited about video in a long time. Ever since my first experience with a music server I've been searching for ways to be rid of discs, be it music or movies, for they're just unnecessary.

I hear ya. I plan on having a video server of somesort for HD material as soon as the option is viable.

This is fun!!

Yes, yes it is.