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Cables It's all about connections. Discuss everything about audio cables ranging from balanced to unbalanced, speaker cables to interconnects and beyond.

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Old 05-15-2008   #13
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Default Re: Dispelling audio myths, the cable lie

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Originally Posted by bgreinke View Post
I agree with some of the posts above, good cables can make a noticeable difference. As support, I'd like add an analogy. I work for a chemical company which operates, among other things, a flavors and fragrances business. Talking with one of our chemists who has visited that site, he told me that the plant has a purfumist on staff for final quality checks. The reason...the product has to smell right (not better or worse, the same). They don't rely on measurements of how much of chemical x and how much of chemical y are in the final product (though I'm sure they do measure these things) as the final say on whether the product is on spec. No, they have someone subjectively smell the product and make sure it smells the same as it always has.

The same principle applies to cables. You can take all the measurements of resistance and capacitance that you want, but in the end, they're numbers only. If you have two cables with all the same numbers and they sound different, well, something about the cables is different; possibly something neither manufacturer is aware of but that one manufacturing process does better than the other. Bottom line, I think there are simply too many variables that can impact the precision of a transmitted electrical signal (I'm talking interference from other E&M fields, different crystalline atomic structures of shielding as a result of different production methods, etc) that to say that because a few measurements match two cables must therefore be equal is naive. Just my 2 cents.

Braden
I forgot, what did the blind man say when he walked past the fish market??
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Old 05-15-2008   #14
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Default Re: Dispelling audio myths, the cable lie

I have been reading debates over cables for many decades and its always the same. There is no sound quality benefit to using exotic cables. Double blind tests over the decades have proved that.

There is a difference between zip cable and well made cables, not necessarily in sound but in durability. Good cables of the appropriate sizing for the length needed will sound as good with no degradation of sound quality when compared to exotic cables. Some exotic cables that have been tested in the past were even found to colour the sound.

If you have the money and want the eye-candy cables, go for it, if it makes you happy; if you are like the rest of us Joe's buy good quality cables, take the money you saved from buying exotic and buy some extra cd/dvd and enjoy your system

Or upgrade your speakers. I find most people have cheaped out on speakers compared to what they have paid for the rest of their systems. back in the day of two channel, it was the rule of fifths. one fifth for source, one fifth for preamp, two fifth for poweramp and two fifth for speakers. Power has come down significantly since and the sound quality has improved over the years, but I still try to follow this rule, even with my surround system.

I personally use high quality cables (10 feet per side) which cost me about $120 including ends for my main fronts and they have not let me down.
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Old 05-15-2008   #15
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Default Re: Dispelling audio myths, the cable lie

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Originally Posted by pocketman View Post
I have been reading debates over cables for many decades and its always the same. There is no sound quality benefit to using exotic cables. Double blind tests over the decades have proved that.

There is a difference between zip cable and well made cables, not necessarily in sound but in durability. Good cables of the appropriate sizing for the length needed will sound as good with no degradation of sound quality when compared to exotic cables. Some exotic cables that have been tested in the past were even found to colour the sound.

If you have the money and want the eye-candy cables, go for it, if it makes you happy; if you are like the rest of us Joe's buy good quality cables, take the money you saved from buying exotic and buy some extra cd/dvd and enjoy your system

Or upgrade your speakers. I find most people have cheaped out on speakers compared to what they have paid for the rest of their systems. back in the day of two channel, it was the rule of fifths. one fifth for source, one fifth for preamp, two fifth for poweramp and two fifth for speakers. Power has come down significantly since and the sound quality has improved over the years, but I still try to follow this rule, even with my surround system.

I personally use high quality cables (10 feet per side) which cost me about $120 including ends for my main fronts and they have not let me down.
Nope, High quality cables don't cost $120 including ends.

Jade audio Vermeil gold speaker cable New Retail $2900.00.

From Audiogon

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....pkr&1212865118
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Old 05-16-2008   #16
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Default Re: Dispelling audio myths, the cable lie

Go to Blue Jeans Cable and get either Canare wire and connectors (which are very good) or the Blue Jean Belkin wire. Belkin makes the wire for most wire "manufacturers", they just have different jackets put on. The engineers at Belkin know more about wire than the 10 most astute audiophiles in the world.

There are only three important measurements on analog cable--inductance, capacitance, and resistance. If a manufacturer won't supply you with that information they are snake oil salespeople. Any good RF shielding on analog cabling is easily bought already on the wire from any reputable source.

The day one of these "exotic" cable manufacturers submits to a double blind ABX test and provesd his/her wire passes a cleaner signal is the day I'll buy loads of their cable.

I am not saying that different wire may not sound better TO YOU, but that is undoubtedly because of one of two reasons. 1) It is cable with poor measurements and you happen to like that clipped response because to your ears it sounds smoother. 2) You had inadequate gauge cable before connected to your speakers. 3) The human psyche--for reasons of its own (basically ego and self-worth), usually must justify to the purchaser that the expensive wire must sound better, or since I just bought it I definitely hear more from the music and the soundsatge is wider.

Your room acoustics (with room treatments when usually necessary), very good speakers, a great automatic or manual parametric equalization system, and an amp section that never clips (or almost never clips) for your speakers, and obiously great clean source material---are all so far ahead of wire choice that it benumbs the mind.

The human ear has evolved over millenia to mostly be sensitive to direction, distance, location (why we have stereo ears) and certain frequencies (such as a baby crying or the growl of a predator). It wasn't designed to enjoy music, although that is a wonderful side benefit.

Greg
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Old 05-16-2008   #17
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Default Re: Dispelling audio myths, the cable lie

Quit taking the placebo people, there is no difference in cables and it can be proven! Your constant telling others that there is a difference is just ridiculous and if you Think you can hear a difference well then good for you. I have many degrees in audio engineering and have proven in the lab over and over again, just as the OP stated that there IS NO DIFFERENCE no matter what you believe. I have empirical data and have done hundreds of blind tests to prove otherwise. You are the same kind of people who think that Bose speakers are better than anything else and we all know different.
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Old 05-16-2008   #18
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Default Re: Dispelling audio myths, the cable lie

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I have been reading debates over cables for many decades and its always the same. There is no sound quality benefit to using exotic cables. Double blind tests over the decades have proved that.
Please provide the details for these experiements. Otherwise, I'll continue to trust my own ears.
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